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Wind Turbines.
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villyman
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Joined: Feb 21, 2012
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 10:17 am 
Post subject: Wind Turbines.
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I have recently ordered a small wind turbine kit. This is not because I have suddenly found my green roots or any concern for my carbon footprint but purely to take advantage of the wind that blows passed my house almost constantly and the continuing rise in Tok prices.

I am hoping to power low wattage fluorescent lighting in my outhouses. A chest freezer and my well pump.

The output of the unit is 500w and it is my intention to use this through a controller to keep charged 2 x 150amp batteries. From there the power is to directed through a 2000w surge 1000w constant power inverter. Now the questions:

My well pump has the rated wattage on the label, I can work out the lamp wattage by counting the lamps. So:

1. How do I work out the wattage of the chest freezer which is rated at 0.7Amp. I have looked at a few conversion sites but confusion reigns when I come to the pf calculation. Any sparks out there?

2. Is anyone else using this type of setup, any problems?

Cheers, Tree Hugger Villy.
  
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Leo
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 11:21 am 
Post subject: Watts
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VM it's simple Watt=Voltage*Amps so 220 V*0.7 Amp = 154 Wat

But with freezers etc. the engine (compressor) doesn't run continous and I think the 154 W is when the compressor is running. How often the compressor kicks in depends on the temperature of the environment and the insulation of the freezer.
Manufacturers often state this on their website so I would take a look there.

Also download this free book :

www.victronenergy.com/ElectricityonBoard_rev8_july2004.pdf

It will give a lot of information
  
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Moscow_Wolf
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Location: Near Karnobat

PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 11:35 am 
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I guess that during the Doldrums, you will eat more beans. Laughing

Have you got a link to what you're actually buying? I am interested in a wind/solar set-up that would at least pump up my water supply from the borehole, but last time I looked, the investment was initially high and would take me years to recoup the investment.

Where are you going mount this wind-turbine on a tower or an existing roof?
  
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villyman
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 11:41 am 
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Thanks for that Leo. That was the sort of figure I was getting until I came a cross this pf figure which is confusing me. I don't want screw up the installation or overload the system and do in what will be expensive batteries.

Anyone know what this pf thing is and does it effect my plans. I am going to put a changeover switch into the setup anyway so that I still have "mains" available in case of low battery power.
  
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Leo
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:09 pm 
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VM what does PF stand for ?
It could be the startup load of the compressor,
electric motors use much more current during startup then when running.
  
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Moscow_Wolf
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:19 pm 
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Leo wrote:
VM what does PF stand for ?
It could be the startup load of the compressor,
electric motors use much more current during startup then when running.


In Villyman's case it probably measures Phart Factor. Wink
  
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villyman
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:20 pm 
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If you put in AC single phase in the current type it is asking then for power factor (pf)

Calculator
  
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BG50KWP
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:25 pm 
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PF is Power Factor, the calculation you require gives you the true power consumption.

Example. 80w fluorescent lamp on a 50hz supply.
with no PF capacitor
volts 232, Amp 1.13 Watts 122

Add a PF capacitor
Volts 232, Amp 0.68, Watts 122.

We see that the amperes are less due to the improvement from a capacitor and thus the standard VxA or W/A, W/V is a inaccurate route.

PF calculations are complex and thus perhaps if keep to Watts, Voltage and use the Amps to determine battery use or Ah?

The freezer's power plate should already include
PF correction and maybe why its displayed in amps and not watts?

VM wrote "Wind sock hanging limp after being ripped to shreds a couple of weeks ago. Temperature on the patio 12C." Sure that wee thing of a power generator could survive Shocked
  
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seathrift
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:34 pm 
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I have used a small wind charger on one of my yachts for a number of years. The first things to realise are as follows:
1. They do require a reasonably smooth airflow or they will go round in circles and not
produce much energy. Do not site your generator in the turbulent area behind
trees or buildings. The affected area for low airflow or turbulence can be as much
as 5 times the height of the abstacle, both in front and behind it.
2. Brushes on the generator will require maintainence.
3. The generator will not start producing electricity until the windspeed is above a
certain speed. This should be noted in the manufacturers information.
4. They can be extremely noisy and have the most intrusive ear splitting screech,
especially if they have an automatic brake to slow the generator down in high
winds. Site them well away for your house, for this and the above reasons.
5. They produce a lot of vibration so the mast on which you put them and the
foundation needs to be secure.
6. Unless the maximum current flow is tiny compared to the battery size, you must
install a current dump device to prevent overcharging and therefore battery
gassing. This will destroy your batteries quicker than you can blink.
7. No lead acid battery should be discharged below 50% of it's nominal capacity. From
memory 50% capacity is shown at 12.5v. Plate degredation will occurr rapidly
below this figure.
8. For deep cycle use, as your's will be, then deep cycle batteries are needed for
longer life. These normally have threaded posts to connect the circuit to and not
the thick lead teats as normal on a car battery.
To get the most value from your investment the above notes should be carefully adhered to or you will end up wondering why you bothered.
  
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villyman
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:44 pm 
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The wind drop was temporary as my BG flag and ripped windsock flutter again!! Smile.

Regarding the pf, I can see where the capacitor makes the difference but isn't shown on the installation schematic so will most likely leave it out. Even using the VxA for the Wattage it will still seem to leave me some slack in my setup.
  
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seathrift
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:57 pm 
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To work out the size of battery needed there are a few items that need to be understood:
A battery's capacity as stated by the manufacturer is rated at 25°C. For every 1°C below this figure the battery will loose 1% of it's nominal capacity. At an ambient temperature of 5°C a 100amp. hour battery will have a capacity of only 80 amp. hours. It is vital to keep the batteries in as warm a site as possible.
50% of capacity is the lowest the battery should be drained, or serious plate damage will start to occur.
An accurate means of checking the battery voltage, like a professional multi-meter, is vital.
The wind generators output is usually stated for that at relatively high wind speeds. The actual average output is likely to be well below the stated figures. Take a good look at the graph produced by the manufacturer to see the curve of watts produced for increasing wind speed and make a judgement.
While I think of it, balancing the turbine blades carefully is another important factor. Otherwise it will shake itself to death.
  
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seathrift
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:00 pm 
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villyman I am not sure what you are refering to by a pf, but be sure it is not the current dump I referred to above, because it will be needed if that is the case.  
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Leo
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:00 pm 
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Also check out the inverter manual , a good inverter cuts
the power and gives an alarm when the battery is exhausted to much.
  
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villyman
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:14 pm 
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TURBINE SPEC:

Starting Wind Speed 3m/s (7 mph)
Rated Wind Speed 12.5m/s
Survival Wind Speed 45m/s
Voltage 12 V AC
Rated Power 500W
Maximum Power 500W
Life span is 20 years
Working temperature: -45°C-70°
Large power, low volume, high efficiency
Carbon fiber blades
Automatic stall protection under strong wind
Weather proof industrial strength design
Coated Aluminum alloy construction
Built-in overspeed protection
Exterior working pieces are made from stainless steel material.

CONTROLLER SPEC

Versatile unit will accept 3 phase current from a wind power source.
Designed for 3 phase wind turbine to battery bank. 500 WATT
The customer can monitor all the data and control the wind turbine.
The controller auto brakes the turbine at over 15 miles per hour, to prevent turbine damage.
The unit lights up when battery is full.
MODEL: 500W-12V
Rated output power: 500W
Input voltage range: 16 ~ 14 V
Rated battery: 12V
Max input wind power: 500 W
Over charge protection: 15V ± 0.5V AH
Recommended battery: 1 pc of 12V / 150 AH
Wind Turbine Max input Current: 40 A
Protection of over charge, battery reverse-connection, load short-circuit, wind turbine automatic break
Size: 230 x 120 x70 cm
Weight: 0,6 Kg

12 VOLT - 230v 1000W Sine wave Inverter

Inverter for powering mains appliances for workshops, boats and caravans.
Fully protected with low battery alarm and shut-down, as well as overload, short circuit and high temperature protection.
Supplied with battery terminal connectors.

1000W Max Continuous Output
2000W Peak Power
230 Volt AC Socket
Modified Sine Wave Waveform

29cm x 21cm x 7.5 cm
(L x W x H)
  
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Leo
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 2:25 pm 
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"Fully protected with low battery alarm and shut-down"
Thats good only watch out for the modified sine wave because it's not a true sine wave inverter there is a change of damaging sensitive electronics like TV,Computers and stuff like that .
Some equipment doesn't take a modified waveform very well.
  
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