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some non brexit related politics...
 
 
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scasparz
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 7:50 am 
Post subject: some non brexit related politics...
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Has been sometime since we have not discussed politics other than BREXIT in this forum, thus I bring this hoping for a fertile debate.

How serious would you consider this? Do you believe Mrs Patel's initiatives were personal and thus unknown to the gov, or that alternatively the gov knew while they asked her to keep from disclosing them to the public? Can this be a case where the British gov being under considerable pressure with brexit, suffers from intercommunication and coordination issues? Finally given Mrs Patel was considered a kind of a 'rising star' within her party, do you think she was prematurely back-stabbed by some domestic competitor?

Do not know whether am right or wrong, yet it looks to me Mrs May is tasked with a difficult job that goes above her skills in a party that appears to be divided with more powerful domestic foes rather than friends. Am left with the impression Torries have abandoned Mrs May to fight alone and lose so that then they would then blame her alone for everything. Am I wrong on this?

If memory serves, a few years ago there seem to be a legal obstacle for the then Israeli foreign minister Jipi Livni to visit Britain for reasons I fail to recall. Israel was zealously pushing for Britain to produce fresh legislation that would permit Mrs Livni's trip, while the then British gov appeared highly apologetic if not embarrassed to Israel for 'in a democracy such things may take some time'. Of course I may be wrong on that, yet the attitude of the two govs involved was as if some superpower were rising demands against some kind of a pariah state, which of course cannot be the case. Please do not get me wrong, not an anti-Semite, yet on the other hand do you reckon Israel has a rather long hand into a number of European govs?



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Seedy
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 10:16 am 
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"Non-Brexit"? This is a primarily Brit site - EVERYTHING is related to Brexit! Very Happy
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Sleepy
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 11:08 am 
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Dear PM
Can I resign rather than get sacked? Priti please....

Ok ok I will get my coat!
  
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Moscow_Wolf
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 11:36 am 
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Upon first impressions of reading the article on the BBC, I thought, that is a nice piece of skirt. Laughing

That's as deep as my interest goes in the matter albeit, what makes me sad is the fact that we have and a need a Minister to swan around the world looking for places to give Taxpayers money in the form of Overseas Aid. Pity she has resigned as I was thinking about inviting her here, putting her up in my caravan (all expenses paid) and seeing if I couldn't screw a couple of £Million out of her funds. Rolling Eyes
  
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scasparz
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2017 9:28 pm 
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This article at Guardian provides some insight in relation to the case of Mrs Patel.


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Seedy
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2017 10:27 am 
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The week-end is finally upon us, so I, at least, have a little more spare time to air what passes for my thoughts... Wink

This is perhaps a rather more complicated situation than it might appear, not least because it of necessity requires speculation about what - if anything - Patel might have been thinking and what she was aiming for in the longer term. It's also coloured by what one might think about the Foreign Office (even though it's actually been the FCO for almost 50 years) and the rather strange folk who are rumoured to lurk within its not-so-hallowed portals.

Patel clearly has ambitions, primarily in the political sphere since she has damn-all experience of the real world: her only "non political" work experience was a (very) few years using the "expertise" garnered in media relations (ie briefing journos on what Conservative politicians wanted them to write about) to attempt to make British American Tobacco look slight less grubby than it really is. Her efforts weren't particularly successful, as it was clear that BAT's operations in Burma were not only providing a handy source of money for the military junta there - a lot of it salted away in Switzerland, of course - but also that its workers were being exploited into the bargain, and BAT eventually had to pull out of the country in an embarrassing damage-limitation debacle.

She's clearly handy for the Tories, being a "twofer", and in this crazy PC world she no doubt harbours ambitions of becoming the first BAME châtelaine of No 10. As a typical political animal, she skillfully emulates a weather-vane - viz her amazing Damascene conversion when her long-held and vocal support for capital punishment proved to be politically inexpedient - but still pushes the tobacco companies' interests in parliament....perhaps there will be an interesting Wikileak on other Swiss bank accounts one day? Wink

There is certainly a strong pro-Israel lobby within the Conservative party and personally I'm neither surprised nor against such a thing: the Middle East is unstable at the best of times and Israel represents a stabilising influence there, if only because of its (alleged) nuclear capability and the fact that its interests are, usually, fairly closely aligned with our own. Since the US and UK have managed to stir up successive hornets' nests in the area, it behoves us to support a country which is not only threatened by the consequences of our ill-advised meddling but which is also a friendly and powerful regional ally. Israel is also well aware that Western politics has always been predicated on expediency rather than principle, so it certainly both lobbies hard and cultivates friends in high places - and who can blame it? Its influence in the Middle East is useful to us but a matter of life or death for Israelis.

So, what was Patel thinking when she "forgot" to mention her various extra-curricular meetings? Well, it's no secret that May is only in office because no-one else wanted to drink from the poisoned chalice that she so unwisely reached for after Camoron's political demise; she really didn't have much choice, since it was her one and only chance to make a name for herself, and it was - very faintly - possible that she could pull it off and surprise us all. Worst case scenario for Patel was that she'd get the boot/be invited to fall on her own sword - but with the benefit of an increased profile and a now-public reputation for backing "plucky little Israel" and mixing with serious regional players, while distancing herself from a lame-duck PM who certainly won't survive the first serious leadership challenge that comes along; doubtless Patel doesn't want to find herself, and her political career, a deck-passenger on May's prime ministerial submarine...

As for the FO, they've long been renowned for being not-so closet Arabists, and indeed some probably still dress up as Pantomime Arabs like they used to in the earlier part of the last century. No doubt the now-ex minister's dealings with Israelis would have been frowned upon, and briefed against, by FO officials keen to try to maintain their fading influence (and budget) - especially since the DfID has taken over a lot of the FO's previous work. The current Foreign Secretary is Buffoon Johnson, so the FO has its work cut out stopping him from walking them all off the edge of a cliff and undoing the work of a century or two, all while trying to cling on to as much funding as possible and trying not to end up as the Department for Repatriating British Stag and Hen Party P1$$heads.

So, this could just be a storm in a teacup and the Ship of Fools will continue on its merry voyage towards the nearest handy reef, or we will likely see Patel surfacing as a candidate for No 10 (or at least Conservative leader) once HMS May has sunk with its blind captain at the helm (and all the rats swimming in the opposite direction as fast as their grubby paws will take them). Personally, I don't think that Patel has anything like what it takes to be PM - however neither has May but there she is, faute de mieux....let's just hope that it doesn't come down to a choice between her and Johnson! Rolling Eyes
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scasparz
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2017 4:51 pm 
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Thanks seedy, this has been very informative. But then again, pls take a look here, where Mrs Patel claims to be happy for being supported from the public. Well, is she really?

It is my understanding Golan Heights to be a disputed region originally belonging to Syria annexed by Israel following the six days war back in '67. AFIAK most European states will refuse import local agricultural products in essence refusing the legality of the Israeli sovereignty over the region. In any case why the all mighty Israeli state cannot conduct their humanitarian obligations by themselves in a region some fifty years after they have it claimed for themselves? Has Mrs Patel's initiative actually being a push to improve her credentials in the eyes of the powerful Jewish lobby within the Torries?





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